In reference to combining these:

http://www.sourcefortsmod.com/boards...ad.php?t=11355
http://www.sourcefortsmod.com/boards...ad.php?t=11340
http://www.sourcefortsmod.com/boards...1&postcount=64

Here's some specifics I'd been thinking of.

Rotator plate. For simplicity's sake, cannot be attached to another rotator and it tests for possible collisions when you go to attach something.

Slider. A track that things can be attached to. Same rules as rotator attachment (collision detection, cannot be attached to something else). Moves on friendly use.

Launcher. Has a speed dial on the side.

Flat plate. Resembles the good 'ol 2x3.

One-way gate. Checks for door collisions before allowing placement. Could be used to build traps (i.e., two lead into dead ends while the third leads into base).

Fox hole. Provides excellent cover when crouched, resembles a square in top-down view.

Explosive spawner. Spawns an explosive when touched (or possibly a separate control pad?). Impact/shot detonated. Possible ff?

"Ramp." Looks like a 1x5, possibly shorter. If placed horizontally it gives excellent cover for crouched players.

"Emancipation" field. Passes same team, kills opposing. Drops flag. Possibly cannot place entire field at once, must place individual bars of it (bars could be used to make a guillotine with the slider or a propeller trap with the rotator).

Extendo-bridge. See Star Wars ep4 Death Star bridges. Extends when a player stands on the control side, retracts slowly after. Checks for collisions when placed, etc. Cannot attach to anything? Possibly redundant with slider & 1x5 combo.

Autolathe. Repairs/builds blocks around it. Takes very long to complete a high level one (which has a big radius) but not too long for a low level one. All of them can be seen glowing and sticking out above all but the tallest fortifications. Glows like a motherfucker, fairly fragile, requires LOS to target, and cannot repair same or higher level autolathes.

90 degree hinge. Much like the rotator plate, but looks like a hinge, has a different default spawn orientation, and only goes 90 degrees.



There's some ideas. Feel free to post more or discuss the merits and drawbacks of various. This list is by no means intended to be complete.

For the attachment point blocks, something like the proposed block combo might be useful (highlight which point you want to attach to), but then build the block as per standard (wireframe turns red if the collision checks fail, doesn't prevent placement just does not attach). Attachment points do not feel physics forces, but will supply them.

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Not in cruelty, \ not in wrath, \ the Reaper came today.\ An angel visited \ this gray path, \ and took the cube away.

Devs: Can we put these into the engineer discussion? I really want to bring that back up, because it was an original idea and probably deserves a place in the game =]

With some of these objects, alongside the base and specialised objects in that, the system could be a very good one...


Also, I told you this thread was coming sooner or later XD

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Simply put, I don't think some of these would fit in a combat-based game.

To elaborate: from what I can tell, haven is trying to make combat the center of focus, with building becoming an extension of that combat, i.e., building will play a major role in combat, but is not meant to stand on its own as a part of the game. I hate to use the "gmod" reference, as it's such a lame argument IMO, but I think this is one of the few situations where it fits. From everything I've seen, the intent has been to distance haven from the traditional "building games" and make the building process just another part of combat. With that, I don't think it makes sense to add blocks that entice players to spend a great deal of time making elaborate bases during the game.

This mostly applies to the hinge, rotator, slider, and one-way gate (for things like traps, at least); they really just seem more at home in a sandbox game, not a combat game. You could make the argument that a game where you build things is inherently a sandbox game, but I disagree, because (as I said above) the building is only meant to enhance the combat, not stand beside it as equal in terms of the purpose of the game.

I really just don't like the emancipator. If I read it correctly, it just kills you if you walk through it. Maybe I just haven't played enough games in my life, but I've never seen a situation where a one-hit kill entity has been good for a game, especially when it could easily have been avoided (in this case by just using a solid block). Not to mention the possibilities for raging the other team are practically endless. Just lay some on the floor behind your wall and watch cappers get torn to shreds, despite your team having done practically no work for the kill, and other cheap and annoying tactics.

I like the launcher (jump-pad type deal), and I honestly think it could replace dedicated ramps entirely, with standard blocks becoming more permanent solutions for heavier classes.

I don't think the bridge would be used enough to warrant inclusion in the standard block set.

Given that I think protecting/healing your blocks should be a large part of the game, I don't think the autolathe would be a good addition. I like the concept on as it stands by itself, but I think there's a lot that can be done with that area of the game, and just don't think another block is the best way to handle it.

:< now i feel bad about myself.

k

So perhaps leave the more complicated things in a non-combat class' repertoire, whichever class happens to be the main builder. Not everyone is going to be attacking all the time.

Those are mostly there to be the simplest active elements possible to provide more depth for builders. A rotator with a lancher and explosive spawner on it becomes a cannon, a slider with a wall plate on it is a door, etc. I haven't thought of all of the combos, but there's several.

Theoretically these would be some of the "very long and expensive to build" types. The way I'd envisioned them would be for something like a one-team gate so you could run back in and heal (without being able to carry a flag). That was the big thing about why no one ever bothered healing in 19x is that they were inside an impenetrable base (along with the healers being slow).

k

I'm sure someone can think of a use for it. I included it for coolness factor. Possibly a drawbridge over a mapper-created moat-like object? Like the trench in the first area of cp_dustbowl in tf2.

These would either take a long time to construct or be limited in their usefulness. Also please notice their specified drawbacks: they're fragile and can be easily shot. I figured they would not be a replacement for healers but rather a supplement.

Also I thought you wanted combat to be the large part of the game, so something that lets you worry less about defense of well-fortified areas is bad?

Good. Post more suggestions, less criticisms. Well, I don't really care about criticisms just post more suggestions.

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Not in cruelty, \ not in wrath, \ the Reaper came today.\ An angel visited \ this gray path, \ and took the cube away.

We need more blocks.
I really believe that. It'd a new "thing" to the game, and it's truly important that we remember the building part, in this game.
Also, I like it. It seems like some good ideas for future blocks.

Considering the gameplay itself is changing entirely, we don't need new "things". We need solid gameplay and nice action flow.

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God.

Blah blah blah.

Shut up.

Post blocks.

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Not in cruelty, \ not in wrath, \ the Reaper came today.\ An angel visited \ this gray path, \ and took the cube away.

Speed block
When stood on, teammates are pushed forward or sped up, enemies are pushed back a little or get a speed reduction.

Use: creating slowzones for enemies, could be planted around the field to mess up enemies, could be placed strategically at areas that are vulnerable to trickjumps, could provide a small boost so allies can get off to a good start while bhopping, can be used to make impossible trickjumps possible.
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Why are there two threads about this shizzle?

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Possibly also at the top edges of walls so that it's harder to jump over them?

B/c I think I made this thread to escape the off-topicness in other block threads.

In the category of "very silly ideas" I submit the How About A Nice Game of Chess block: the game ends in an Armageddonesque, MAD rain of nukes when it's activated. Stalemate. It takes about an hour for one builder to construct, but the build rate increases exponentially with every person assisting. It only has 60 hp, so 1 pt of damage sets its construction back a whole minute. Teammates can damage this block. In b4 "dumb." No shit. I told you it was just for lulz.

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Not in cruelty, \ not in wrath, \ the Reaper came today.\ An angel visited \ this gray path, \ and took the cube away.

Sayyan, I have to say I disagree. While I don't care for the extremely building oriented blocks introduced here, I don't think it's wise to discount the importance of such specialty blocks altogether. As I said in my block thread, blocks are one of the few things that definitively separates SF from other class based shooters like TF2, so you would do well to capitalize on that as a means of breaking away from the natural evolution of the genre. Every game has different weapons, every game has different classes, but few games do much to actually alter the way you play it, and an innovative block/equipment/entity system gives you an excellent way to do exactly that. "Solid gameplay" is all well and good, but "solid, innovative gameplay" is better. You are in a perfect position to accomplish that, so you would do well to make that happen.